PT6 "officialy" Announced..., at last Options

[Odrec]

I would like an MBox because of the Focusrite preamps, and because it offers a hardware/software affordable solution (circa $500)...

But I would like any audio sequencer to be within my budget; Cubase, Logic, DP...

If you actually gave me a choice I would go with DP3 or Logic Audio 5 and a MOTU808. All this apps basically do the same exact thing, and it is basically a question of detail and taste.

Odrec

[Levon River]

Quote:
what is it that sells people on ponying up the extreme cash required to start--and maintain--the ProFools habit? (Levon River @ Oct 7 2002, 09:35)

well i wasn't THAT expensive, considering the Mbox and PTLE bundled for 500$. I'm not saying it's the best but if all you want is to record and edit audio (without having to deal with compatibility issues), then it seems like a fair price.

Yeah, that's *another* reason I personally can barely abide the company. I know that they know that learning any serious DAW+MIDI program is a serious investment in time, work, study, experience, and ripped-out hair.

Start with that "fair price" package, LE and 001, and the day you need your 25th track, or more audio inputs, or more flexibility or performance in any of the directions their high-end systems go, you either pony up the dinero to maintain the habit, or you start over your learning curve on a different system.

They didn't even add integrated stereo tracks--get that: stereo tracks--to LE until the latest version.

We haven't touched on ProTools Free, and of course it's the *only* software they make that will work without thir "DigiDesign approved ProFools Dongle system." Pushers make the first one free. Eight tracks of audio. Let's see: Snare, Kick, HiHat, Crashes, Toms, shaker, bass. Hmmm. Well, I guess this song can have a mono piano. Or... Now where did I put that spare $10,000? My other pants?

I personally think ProTools Free is the stupidest move they every made, because with it they proved conclusively that they *can* make their software work with the native audio of the Mac and/or other hardware interfaces. So the only reason their software versions with more tracks and options doesn't is... Doh!

as for the bigger systems, I really don't know.

Now where did I put that spare $10,000? My other pants?

Anyway, I'd still like to know what the attraction really is. I'd still like to see something that can be done on a ProTools system that can't be done in, e.g., Digital Performer. I'm not stating categorically that there isn't. I'm just saying I've never seen it..

[bixpender]

have you fools nothing better to do than being smart asses all day long?

some people like windows other like mac's

some guys like big tits others don't

some people like pro tools others don't!

who gives a s### what you think.

JEEEZ

[Mr.T]

Right on Bixpender! Enough of this already!!!
And furthermore, not only do "some people" think they're smart asses but they also preach while being uninformed:

Start with that "fair price" package, LE and 001, and the day you need your 25th track

I own that "stupid" 001 you're refering to... You might want to know that we have 32 tracks available since last summer... Get informed, stop preaching BS and get back to work !... Enough already!
Have a nice day.

PS: BTW I like firm tits.. big or not, doesn't matter.
Greetings Brooklyn!

[Levon River]

And furthermore, not only do "some people" think they're smart asses but they also preach while being uninformed:

Start with that "fair price" package, LE and 001, and the day you need your 25th track

You are *so* right Mr. T! I pity the po' fool who tries to slide one past you! The low-end ProFools package with only 24 tracks that aladinsane was referring to (and I was responding about) was the *Mbox* package, and I, like an idiot, typed "001" where I should have typed "Mbox." Thank whatever gods there are for having clever and articulate people like you around moderating.

So, yes: by paying almost TWICE as much as the 24-track-limited Mbox/LE package, you get the power-user 001/LE package for only $995, and DippiDesign rewards you for that extra $495 with EIGHT MORE AUDIO TRACKS! Whoooowee! I wouldn't want to sell them short on all they give you. Thank you, thank you, thank you for pointing out the error of my ways. I'm sure DippiDesign thanks you, too!

(Hmmm. But wait a minute, now; ProFools Free gives you eight audio tracks for...well, for FREE. But if you get them with an 001, they cost you $495.00. Hmm. Maybe the eight audio tracks that come with the 001 are *magic* audio tracks! Or maybe I better check the batteries on this calculator here...)

I own that "stupid" 001 you're refering to...

<Tsk, tsk, tsk> Now, now, Mr. T. You must have really had your panties in a wad, or a speck of spittle on your Moderator Glasses, because I didn't use the word "stupid" anywhere in referring to the 001. Are your own hostilities toward your 001 seeping out here? And I already admitted that I made a mistake. Okay, I'll say it again: I'm sorry that I said your power-user 001 system with 32 tracks was limited to 24, like the ProFools Mbox system is. I was wrong. Just dead wrong. Can we kiss and make up now?

You might want to know that we have 32 tracks available since last summer...

Well, that's mighty fine for you. Congratulations. Yes, I named the wrong package inadvertently, and you are exactly correct: DippiDesign *did* decide to arbitrarily limit you power-user 001 owners to 32 tracks, not 24 like they arbitrarily decided to limit the Mbox buyers to. Of course, other DAW software manufacturers don't feel like they ought to dictate to you how many tracks you can have, allowing you to decide that for yourself based on what your system configuration can handle. But I'm sure the gurus at DippiDesign know what's best for you, and apparently you agreed with them. And I'm proud for you.

PS: BTW I like firm tits.. big or not, doesn't matter.

Generally, you're limited to 2 at a time on those, no matter what kind of system you have. YMMV.

[Levon River]

have you fools nothing better to do than being smart asses all day long?

No, speaking only for this fool, being a smart ass only requires about ten minutes of my day. Then I have the rest of the day to think about how to invest my ten smart-ass minutes for the next day.

some people like windows

You call those "people"? (I'm really trying to make the most of my ten minutes today.)

some guys like big tits others don't

Don't pick up the soap around the ones who don't.

some people like pro tools

You call those "people"? <Rim-shot, crash>

who gives a s### what you think.

MULTIPLE CHOICE:

A. People who've been smart enough to stay away from ProTools.
B. People who are really upset at what I say because they weren't.
C. People who feel it important enough to respond to. (Hi!)
D. Mr. T

[Mr.T]

I really admire you... taping all those useful informations seem to have taken almost one hour (?!...) of your precious time... and it was night time... If you also took some of that time to learn tolerance and civility, and could work (just a little) on that natural aggressivity of yours, maybe we could "kiss and make up"... but I doubt you really want that...
Remember, you only reap what you sow...
Have a nice day. Really...

[Levon River]

I really admire you...

Really? You have a funny way of showing it, like: "smartass," "quit preaching BS," "get back to work." Why don't you take some of that natural aggressiveness and address some of the *substantive* and *on-topic* issues I raised about Pro-Tools, Mr. Moderator, instead of slinging cheap-shot ad hominem at one of your users. Or is ad hominem all you got to come back with?

taping all those useful informations seem to have taken almost one hour (?!...) of your precious time...

I wasn't "taping" anything in order to idly deal with bixpender's off-topic ad hominem attack, and your first round of childish and churlish "Me Too!" ad hominem backing him up, Mr. Twit. Obviously, you don't multitask: I do. In fact I was in the middle of helping two friends get a demo mixed and burned that had to be delivered first thing in the morning, only dealing with your crap in my idle time. So your inexcusable abuse of your Moderator privileges in publishing that kind of private information was completely wasted, wasn't it? Are you proud? When are you going to get back on-topic and address the on-topic issues I raised regarding ProTools? Never?

and it was night time...

I guess being able to read a time stamp is what qualified you for Moderator. It sure as hell wasn't for any ethics as a moderator or for keeping threads on topic. Why don't you address some of the FACTS about the on-topic ProTools issues I raised? Can't?

If you also took some of that time to learn tolerance and civility,

I guess you mean like your cheap-shot "Me Too!" gang-bang ad hominem attacks on me and your abuse of your privileges in publishing private information about my board usage in a public forum. Is that the kind of example I should be following, Preacher? When are you going to stop taking cheap personal shots and address some of the on-topic FACTS I published?

and could work (just a little) on that natural aggressivity of yours,

I was posting on-topic facts and opinions about the TOPIC of this thread. You're the one who decided to turn it into a personal p*ss*ng contest by "Me Tooing" bixpender in his off-topic ad hominem. Some Moderator. So go psychoanalyze somebody who cares, and answer the issues about ProTools with substance and facts instead of another tantrum. It's unbecoming.

maybe we could "kiss and make up"... but I doubt you really want that...

I wouldn't kiss you if *your* tits were 42 Double-D. Answer the issues about ProTools.

Remember, you only reap what you sow...

Hey, he's a Moderator *and* a Psychoanalyst *and* a Philosopher *and* a Whiner. Well, here's a little down-home philosophy for you, too, and maybe somebody can help you understand what it means: "If you f*** with the bull, you get the horns." But you're welcome to keep coming back for more.

In the meantime, since there obviously is no responsible moderator on this thread, let me see if I can "steer" (that was a pun) you back on topic: Why don't you tell me something that ProFools can do that, e.g., DP can't do--and do without investing a single dime in DippiDesign's proprietary hardware. See? That was the on-topic question I had that *still* nobody has answered. Is it possibly because there *is* no substantive answer? Could *that* be what's behind all this childish ad hominem being slung at me?

Have a nice day. Really...

Hey, we got a *great* demo, and I'm having a *marvelous* day, thanks. Just not very much sleep. But I think that the actually working musicians reading this have all been there...

[Levon River]

I would like an MBox because of the Focusrite preamps, and because it offers a hardware/software affordable solution (circa $500)...

Well, I sure appreciate somebody remaining on-topic in this thread, and can certainly understand the appeal of the preamps. I guess that has to be weighed against budget and other options for audio interface+preamps. It's not that that the MBox system isn't an attractively-priced package, probably suitable for any number of projects. My objection is to the arbitrarily-imposed limitations that they hard-code into the software so that if and when you do want to expand and continue with them, you can get bit in the wallet--hard.

For me, neither their hardware or their software, even at the high end, has anything approaching performance capabilities that justify the high price when compared to what else is available--now, as opposed to when ProTools (and SampleCell) first created their monopoly.

If you actually gave me a choice I would go with DP3 or Logic Audio 5 and a MOTU808.

All my research and hands-on experience so far points me in a similar direction, with final bang-for-buck capability being a primary consideration. (I take it you meant 828?)

All this apps basically do the same exact thing, and it is basically a question of detail and taste.

I agree wholeheartedly. That was part of my point in asking what ProTools software can do that others (like DP, etc.) can't. Given ProTools snobby proprietary approach, and the fact that I view their hard-wired limitations to their own hardware (which also now has some *serious* competitors) as little more than an elaborate, slick, and thinly-disguised dongle system--when other DAW software developers at least attempt to allow you the freedom to put together your own system with hardware of your own choosing--I personally don't get the attraction to ProFools.

There was a time, before computers reached the speed and power capabilities they have now, when paying for ProTools' monopoly at least made some sort of sense, because their hardware was taking up the slack and overcoming limitations inherent in the host computers.

But that time has come and gone as far as I'm concerned. There are some very affordable and capable audio/MIDI interfaces around now, powerful (and flexible) DAW packages with included DSP, and lotso' cheap RAM. It's a winning combination, as I see it, that doesn't have to keep a kid from going to college.

[Mr.T]

Boy, you're really out of your mind... I've seen many trolls on different forums, but you're definitely the greatest one!... OK, here we go and then I'll let you loose it again and write your 123 lines long posts...

So your inexcusable abuse of your Moderator privileges in publishing that kind of private information was completely wasted, wasn't it?

If you were not just bouncing here like a mad man, shouting at people and talking crazy, you would have noticed that the time a post has been written can be found (by any normal member...) at the top of the post... No need to be a modrator for that... Stop being paranoid...
Speaking of which, I do agree with you on one thing ... I'm not made to be a moderator and you might be happy to learn that I've asked to the people who created this board to erase me from the list. I find it harder and harder to keep my cool with people like you around and I definitely agree that a moderator should always...well, moderate. Meanwhile, don't be too proud of yourself, you're not the only troll that made me loose my cool these past days...

Why don't you take some of that natural aggressiveness and address some of the *substantive* and *on-topic* issues I raised about Pro-Tools, Mr. Moderator, instead of slinging cheap-shot ad hominem at one of your users.

You're not one of my user... I didn't create that website and don't see myself as some kind of boss here... I'm just trying to help the good fellows who created it keeping it a pleasant and informative place.
I can imagine your quote : "pleasant"?! Yes, believe it or not, most of the time, I'm only here to help people out (specialy on the french section of this forum-> Yes I'm french! How funny is that? I'm sure you'll enjoy finding some good words about that...) but sometimes some trolls like you really piss me off.
I've been reading (some) of your posts these last weeks without interfering, although most of them were complete non-sense and only made to piss the others off.
Well I started this post just to make sure that stupid PT users like myself would have the info that PT6 was about to be released... and suddenly: here you come with your big mouth and all that useless provocation. I've waited long enough and really had to tell you what I thought of your behaviour.
I knew that would only urge you to write more of that non sense crap you've been feeding us with since you've arrived on this board.
I hate people like you who only show up to spit on people, trying to be smarter (specialy when they're not) but who never participate in anything constructive. How many people have you helped here...none...I've seen you've replied to ONE post lately...congratulations!

When are you going to stop taking cheap personal shots and address some of the on-topic FACTS I published?

"On topic facts"???!!!... Where?... You mean when you say that there's nothing feasible in PT that can't be done in DP!! What a breaking news!! When you say that the extra 8 tracks in LE must be "magic"??...How informative!! And you want me to discuss this issue with you?!... What's the point? I own both PT and DP and do know what I like in one soft or in the other... but ...discuss this...with YOU?!... Never, that would just be a waste of time, you've already made up your twisted mind!

So once again, the moderator that I still am for a few hours honestly apologize for his behaviour, but the former (and soon to be again) member wouldn't change a line. Get lost!