helo...

just got a G5... but not sure about getin sound into it!

was thinking of getting a MOTU 828 mk2 and running in a Mackie 1604vlz pro mixer cos i need preamps for recording drums. any ideas what effect the mixer inside the MOTU will have on top of the analogue mixer... do you bypass the internal mixer?

any ideas as an alternative setup maybe?

thanks

dan

sounds like a great setup to me, danington.

the fw soundcard is a nice way to sidestep the whole pci card slot problem with the new towers, and the mackie will give you the additional flexibility for your drum mics. isn't there some way you can run the drum mics all into the 828? seems a shame to have to mixdown your drums straight off when the 828 is ready with all those inputs.

maybe if you got a mixer with enough aux sends you could manage to record all your mics separately? not sure what the best choice is and whether this is an ideal, but it seems like a bonus to me - giving you flexibilty to tweak the kick and the snare on separate tracks.

basically... if you get the MOTU... i think it only has 2 pre's so... yes you can run all the drum mics into the 828 but they all won't be able to use the pre's. So you could actaully get say one or two nice condensor mics to use say for overheads or ambient sound and then use mics like Sure SM57, PG52 etc. for rest of kit and then just get XLR to 1/4" cables for these and run into analog inputs on 828 thus eliminating the need for the Mackie. The Mackie might have better mic pre's though. This would be most versatle I think.

But IMHO... a good drum sound can be had from as little as 2 or 3 well placed and suited mics to make things more simple. I read TapeOp (www.tapeop.com - free subscription) and its all about recording and there are many articles from guys in the business that have gone back to basics so to speak when recording drums.

but if you were to get the Mackie... you could always save money on the audio interface and get something with 2-4 inputs instead of the 828 and just feed all mics to Mackie and stereo out from Mackie to your audio interface

added note: ok i am not 100% positive my idea of using XLR to 1/4" cable for Sure SM57 and etc will work or not... was just thinking about line level thing and I can't remember if a mic pre is needed for those type of mics or not. My system is down waiting for new Hd or I would test my theory out for you... maybe someone else can verify this or tell me i was wrong

I have a question along those lines.

The SM57 and similar (dynamic) mics dont' use phantom power as condenser mics do. Does that mean that there is no need for a pre-amp or are they two separate things?

actually I think they are different... condensor mics need power to pickup as much detail as they do I think and dynamics are less sensitive and don't require power... now whether a dynamic mic actually needs a pre-amp to work is a question I am not sure about. The preamp actaully boosts the signal so this is how phantom power is different from the preamp but I haven't had to ever use a SM57 etc without a preamp of some kind.

I don't think a Shure SM57 necessarily needs a preamp - I think if you plugged it into a guitar amp, it would amplify your toneless shouting (oh, wait, that might be just me) as required. Whether it would sound any good is another matter. Preamps generally help deliver a nicer sound whatever the mic.

On the whole drum issue, I've never miked a kit in my life but I concur that simplicity seems to be a popular approach. Some people even use just the one - a top-notch condenser placed just right seems to get great-sounding results. Lenny Kravitz apparently does this a lot and, say what you like about his music, the man knows his vintage recording techniques.

Led Zeppelin's drum recordings used this approach a lot, too, but they might have had the kit set up in the grand hallway of an old French chateau to take advantage of the amazing acoustics. I think When The Levee Breaks was done something like this (which inspired Sophie B Hawkins for the drum sound on Damn, I Wish I Was Your Lover).

A good room is definitely as beneficial as the mics used (for any instrument or vocal recording), but I can appreciate that not many of us live in old French chateaux.

Hey Danington
the 828 mkII and 1604 vlz would be a perfectly suited kit for recording drums
a few tips:
-I would plug ( up to ) 8 mics into the first eight channels of the 1604
-then I would get a balanced snake ( 8-1/4"- TRS connectors on each side of the snake) - should be available at any pro music store
-plug one side of the snake into the 8 "direct outs" of the 1604 ( these are post pre - post eq outs of the first eight channels)
- then the other end of snake would be plugged into all eight 1/4" inputs on the 828

setting it up this way will allow you to record eight separate tracks of drums w/ a really good signal to noise ratio

Have Fun!

to the other posters - when you reply to people seeking advice on this forum, please be like good doctors and remember your hypocratic oath, "first do no harm" if you aren't sure about the subject matter, you only serve to confuse the issue

Dabr

ok... I don't see many pro recording engineers (doctors) on this board that are willing to just jump in and help others for "free"... just as with any other forum... take advice with a grain of salt because what you read is only advice and not a manual to follow. Not to mention there are SEVERAL different ways to do many things. So Dabr... I think most of us are here with intention of "doing no harm" and if u want everyone to be 100% correct and sure of their posts then you are gonna a lot less help from everyone because most of are just relating info from our own experiences and its called "disccusion" which is what the forums are based on... so Lighten up man.